EASHL Builds *NHL18*

Discussion in 'Leaguegaming Hockey League (LGHL)' started by TVK, Aug 9, 2017.

  1. TVK

    TVK Gluten free since '93

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    Forwards
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    Back by popular demand
    I didn't include goalie builds because goalies are not actual people so it really didn't matter.
     
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  2. ShortyxLOSE

    ShortyxLOSE LGHL BOG / S28 Tucson LW Staff Member LGHL BOG

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  3. KeBrik

    KeBrik Well-Known Member

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    PMD is very intriguing this year. In 3s he is really fun to use and cover the ice really well and wow those breakout passes but i'm not sure yet if he is a viable option in 6s. I'll probably stick to my TWD but still very intriguing...
     
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  4. Meeezzyy

    Meeezzyy Showtime #39

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  5. Jack Bauer tuna

    Jack Bauer tuna Legend Platinum

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  6. SpIooosh

    SpIooosh Well-Known Member LGHL Owner (XB1)

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    PMD is more than viable in 6s, I played quite a bit of D in the beta and was the only build I used. TWD is way too clunky.
     
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  7. SpIooosh

    SpIooosh Well-Known Member LGHL Owner (XB1)

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    It's easy to realize which builds suck and which builds are good.
     
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  8. LG McDonald

    LG McDonald Director of Hockey Operations Staff Member Admin

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    FYI,

    those sliders for the builds don't have a direct relationship to the actually attributes.

    It doesn't affect overalls either. Like Playmaker has a higher overall than TWF
     
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  9. Stewkos

    Stewkos Well-Known Member LGHL GM

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    Can they just show us the attributes then?
     
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  10. LG McDonald

    LG McDonald Director of Hockey Operations Staff Member Admin

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    I'll ask again but I doubt I'll be allowed to.
     
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  11. Stewkos

    Stewkos Well-Known Member LGHL GM

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    Can you shed some light on why they can't just be transparent about it? It's frustrating compared to fifa, where you can see the difference from changing your height, the slight variance in attributes based on the role you select etc.
     
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  12. LG McDonald

    LG McDonald Director of Hockey Operations Staff Member Admin

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    I'm not 100% sure. I just know I've signed an NDA and certain topics EA reserves the right to tell me I can't discuss it.

    I 100% know all the attributes because I put some extensive time into making some making change requests etc. I've taking the builds into practise mode on the right game setting and tried stuff to make suggestions

    3v3 I knew about last Dec. But our NDA we sign limits when we can talk about our feed back and when we can discuss stuff. It's up to them.

    If I had to take an educational guess it would be that attributes are extremely suggestive. Therefore showing the community just opens a can of worms about "why doesn't this guy have this amount of passing" it's just more bs to deal with. When in reality a lot of these attributes are what we used in NHL 14
     
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  13. Stewkos

    Stewkos Well-Known Member LGHL GM

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    I mean I know there's nothing you personally can do about it, but they've been perfectly happy to ignore the community whenever they don't feel like talking about a decision (ex. Game Speed being too low, or the Tennis ball dump bounces in 14).

    You literally said that they've released info that is not an accurate representation of the attributes, how is that somehow better than just releasing the attributes?
     
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  14. LG McDonald

    LG McDonald Director of Hockey Operations Staff Member Admin

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    That's your interpretation of what I said.

    Those sliders for the builds you can't directly do what you said. For example you "added" up stuff and said the TWF IS A "16" and the playmaker is a "14".

    I interpret that as "TWF is a higher overall than playmaker" when I know that isn't the case.

    Those sliders arent a misrepresentation of the attributes, they are to give players a visual indication of what each build is stronger at. Adding them together I feel is a misrepresentation of a player types overall

    So if you compare playmaker to a grinder right away you'll see that one has higher passing and the other has higher strength.

    That could obviously be represented by physically showing us the attributes like a HUT card as well.

    As for ignoring the community that use to be my opinion at times as well. Being on with the GC and having the ability to physically share what our community wants I no longer feel that way. I've come to realize at times we here at LG represent a small portion of the EASHL community and represent an extremely hardcore player base. I'm bias as you all are too and feel our opinion should be what truly shapes the outlook of EASHL for everyone else to aspire to the level we are on.

    I feel we have a strong influence even at times when it feels like we dont.

    I know the game still feels slow in eashl but I physically know how much the skating attributes increased because I am the guy who gave them the new attributes. I feel faster in 18 than I do in 17 but I know my work isn't done yet.

    My eyes are on things like endurance and slight increases to skating yet again to reach that point I feel we all want.

    It has been put into perspective for me a few times as I continue to try and be a dominate voice for this vass community. Forwards wanna be faster. Dman want forwards to be slower. Goalies wanna be faster goalies want forwards to be slower lol. Forwards feel the DSS is too fast dman feel it's perfect. Forwards want a quicker right stick and dman love how the RS is for forwards.

    Everything is so damn suggestive that the level of thought that goes into who is "right and wrong" what needs to change and not change nearly makes game tuning rocket science. The game play producer IMO is 90% why the game is getting better and better. Him and I have a lot of debates where I preach the LG wants and needs and we tend to see eye to eye on a lot.

    It's just a process and things take time to fully adapt and change.

    The biggest thing I've learned is just because I strongly believe something needs to change and my close circle of friends agree doesn't always mean it is 100% best for everything.

    I think the level of feed back I've gotten from LG is awesome. The amount of depth we have written down better supports what we want. I'm summarizing all of it today and tomorrow for EA to review and I believe a lot our wants will make it into the game. Nothing has been 100% confirmed from them, this is just completely my opinion
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2017
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  15. BLicK12

    BLicK12 Well-Known Member

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    The root of the issue regarding the builds seems to be that EA either didn't program correctly or doesn't know exactly how each attribute actually effects player performance or the gameplay. This is why custom builds were so broken on previous gen. Where, for instance, something like acceleration didn't matter whatsoever (I wouldn't be at all surprised if this is still the case). Now, at least everyone is on even playing field, but we still don't know exactly how weighted certain attributes are.

    And Brodie there's no way you can say with a straight face that EA's communication is anything other than outrageously poor. That's another issue entirely.

    And to your point about the EASHL community's advice, most of what is suggested regarding gameplay would improve every single game mode, not just EASHL. Not getting stuck in a shot animation 8 times over would be pretty practical on OVP as well *shrug*. If we had any influence over the game, we still wouldn't be lacking things like lobbies. Instead, we're getting things like a tie-up feature that is useless and brand new between the legs dekes, and a bunch of dekes that already existed on last gen.

    You're learning that EA is a business is great and all. But the fact is, their game has taken 3 years to get to a point where it's passable as a "full game"... even then it is still missing many things that were already in the game.
     
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  16. LG McDonald

    LG McDonald Director of Hockey Operations Staff Member Admin

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    Communaiton between them and the general community hasn't ever been great. That's why we all felt left in the dark for several years. You

    Communication between them and us as game changers is excellent. We basically talk to them every day and can have issues addressed when we have questions.

    I wish there was less legal red tape that gave me the ability to talk more for them. Obviously with the relationship I have with this community and how active I am I would be able to engage often about a lot of issues and concerns we have.

    It has been a long long process to get to where we are I 100% agree. But I also am a realist in the sense that me complaining about their lack of resources, how shitting some parts of the game is or whatever else the general community has isn't productive. No level of communication from me to them will increase their budget for their NHL series games. I'm trying to focus my energy on things I can have an influence on rather than issues that are way above any of us.

    There is a lot about attributes I think that needs to be looked as well. Many people feel that acc does nothing. A lot of guys liked no awarness etc. You are right the old attribute system was drastically broken.
     
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  17. xJAYlive

    xJAYlive Active Member

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  18. BLicK12

    BLicK12 Well-Known Member

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    Well, you nailed why not communicating with the fan base is bad for business. We don't know what is realistic for this developmental team to tackle or what is within our sphere of influence. We don't know what actually gets read or taken seriously.

    Yeah, now we have Gamechangers to act as our voice, which is great and all, certainly a welcome addition. But we also have Gamechangers that will say whatever EA makes is great and be less inclined to bring up glaring issues or things that can be fixed. It's a double edged sword, you guys are the voice of the community, but you're also stewards for their game. All I heard going into NHL 17 was how great it was going to be, and it was maybe slightly less shitty than NHL 16 (which is the only NHL game I straight up stopped playing).

    As for what we can and can't influence, I can't for the life of me comprehend how something is implemented like the "tie-up" feature that was put in NHL 17. When there are so many dramatic flaws with the gameplay, we're instead given the most half baked, worthless defensive feature that if anyone actually tested for 5 minutes could tell you would never be practical to use in an actual game. That tells me multiple things... 1) They aren't listening to the community and what is really needed and 2) They are perfectly fine with putting out halfassed work and calling it a day (although they've demonstrated that with NHL 15, 16 and 17).

    We can cite the resources and bandwidth as the issue until we're blue in the face. But a good leader makes the best of what they have and if you can't realistically implement something, sometimes you're better off leaving it off the docket and focusing on the other things that matter. I can't imagine the NHL team was running rich with resources and budget money on old gen and yet they consistently had one of the best sports games on the market (that's not even just opinion, they actually won awards). How this series has taken such a drastic turn and seen such little change year over year is a pretty damning indictment over this development team. Combine that with the overall lack of communication and it is pretty easy to see why a lot of people are beyond frustrated.

    My rant aside, this thread is about the attributes and I really don't think the attribute system has changed at all from last gen. Someone should do the acceleration test with a practice player and see what it shows.
     
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  19. P3k1ng DuK

    P3k1ng DuK Well-Known Member

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    PMD is the only built I used in the beta because I feel like the others are really slow, I think it's the best built to play a two way style even if there is one called two way
     
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  20. LG McDonald

    LG McDonald Director of Hockey Operations Staff Member Admin

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    What is neat is there are is a lot more reading and such going on on their forums and actually on our forums now. We have members of EA playing in our Leagues on GTs that people don't know about. So they are listening. They live and breath this game everyday and have a stronger understanding of what can realistically be accomplished during a game than you or I have.

    I can and will only speak for myself, when it comes to being a voice. Our jobs as GC is to bring EA the feed back, and more often than not from a competitive community like ours, there tends to be more negative than positive. I don't pull my punches when I am there, and without question I am extremely vocal and opinionated when I get my chance to be. I'm 29 now, with a professional career where I deal with people. That allows me to voice concerns that this community shares without being radical like some of the things we see tweetd at rammer. I'm not a yes man, but I am not going to follow the group and say I hate game either. My role is to find what is good and ensure it remains in the game, and find what needs to be changed and push the envelope to ensure it gets changed. I enjoy the few day vacation away from reality I get every few months from EA but I am pretty in touch with what my role is. Between LG and VHL I've been doing this for 8 years. If these leagues never grew so big and so competitively I never would have been afforded an opportunity to sit at the table with EA. So I treat each event like it will be my last chance to speak to them. I act as professionally as I can and continue to act with the best interest of LG in mind.

    As a reference; my NHL 17 thoughts are:
    • Puck pick ups need work
    • game is too slow
    • builds needs some adjustments
    • passing needs improvements
    • offensive players need more tools to be successful
    • goalies need WAY more love
    • it's better than 16 and 15(X1)
    From what I've played within my experience beta testing, my NHL 18 thoughts are:
    • Builds need more endurance
    • Slight increase to the already increased attributes of speed, acceleration, and agility
    • more work to puck pick ups
    • removal of auto pick up animations that "lock" you into a certain skating lane. often this puts your offside.
    • I feel the RS dekeing slows a player down too much, but I see how it was not enough in 17.
    • I'm not 100% sure DSS is too fast or if the RS is just too slow which gives a defending player an advantage
    • Pokes from behind need to draw more trips
    • Overall this is better than 16 and 17
    The tie up comparison I think is valid and my rely is STRICTLY my opinion and not a reflection of what is their intent, because I don't know 100%.

    My opinion is guys like us, would take a game that is the EXACT same but with the glaring issues fixed. Hence why many of us loved 15 vs 14 on the 360... So yes glaring issues addressed is a win. From a business stand point they can't sell a game without something new or an addition. Therefore that would create a time consumption issue where time is spent to fix legacy issues, but time has to be allotted to build new stuff. I struggle with that as well, hence why I try my best to prioritize issues when I submit them to EA. As an example, the endurance and skating attributes in EASHL are more important to me than puck pick ups right now. I believe that they should have time to address ALL my concerns, but if I had to pick one, I'd make the game a bit faster than it is now.

    We know EA has a wish list of additions and fixes etc they they hammer things off each year. Some issues stay on the list too long, but overall they are dedicated to fix those concerns. Us as hardcore players and consumers also want these things faster. I am in the same boat. I wish they had more time and resources to give us what we want faster. What keeps me positive is how much they listen to us and how things are getting better. Its slow I know, but it is getting better.

    I enjoy these discussions so I can get out as much info as I am allowed to, and give our community a better understanding. By no means am I making excuses for EA, like I said above I am extremely vocal and opinionated. I believe in having a positive attitude and being realistic once I have an understanding of what their capabilities are.
     
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